Name Help is a series at Appellation Mountain. Every week, one reader’s name questions will be discussed. We’re relying on thoughtful comments from the community to help expectant parents narrow down their name decisions. Thank you in advance for sharing your insight! To have your question considered, email appmtn (at) gmail. Looking for your own private #namehelp post? Order one here.
SHOULD THEY SAVE THIS NAME FOR A SON?
Meredith writes:
We have a daughter named Charlotte Eden, called Lottie. I love her name, and even though we do meet other Charlottes, her nickname helps. Charlotte is a name we both loved. Eden is a name I liked but I wasn’t sure about for her first name.
When we were expecting Charlotte, we agreed that we’d name a boy Joseph. Joseph is my grandfather’s name and my husband’s dad’s name, too. They’re both named after other men in their family, and my dad and brother both have Joseph as a middle name.
Now we’re expecting our second child later this year. If it was a boy, his name would be Joseph. But we just found out we’re having a girl.
For a lot of reasons, I’m not sure if a third child will happen for us. So I feel like we need to decide if we should keep saving Joseph for a boy someday, or if we should name this baby Josephine.
I do really like the name Josephine, and I think Lottie and Josie sound great together.
My husband is less sure. He think it’s maybe “not the same thing.”
So, should we be saving the name for a son?
The other name I like a lot with Charlotte is maybe Frances, because I get all the JD Salinger vibes from Franny, but I’m not sure it’s the one and my husband is lukewarm.
Our last name sounds like Parks with an M.
Please read on for my response and leave your thoughtful suggestions in the comments.
TO SAVE OR NOT TO SAVE?
Abby replies:
Congratulations on your new daughter!
This is definitely a case of making two separate decisions.
First, let’s talk about Joseph.
It sounds like it’s a happy coincidence that one of The Most Significant Names in Both of Your Families also happens to be a name you like and agree on.
But if you dig a little deeper, can you identify which matters more?
- We want to honor both families, and all of these important people in our lives, by using the name Joseph.
- We really like the name Joseph, and appreciate that it has so much meaning to our families.
The difference is subtle, but significant.
Because if honoring your loved ones matters most?
Then I don’t think you should wait. There’s a chance you won’t have a third child. There’s also a chance that, even if you do eventually grow your family, you might never have a son.
But maybe you both just like the name Joseph, and all the loved ones sharing the name is a bonus.
That’s different, isn’t it? In that case, you like the name Joseph. And you’ll have to evaluate Josephine independently. Maybe it works … maybe it’s just not for you.
Of course, you and your husband might answer that question differently. Which is fine! It’s the key conversation to have before moving forward.
For the moment, I’m going to assume that you like Joseph for a boy, and that honoring loved ones is a secondary consideration. Let’s find more girl names that:
- Count as classic choices
- Come with a sparky, built-in nickname
- Sound right with big sister Charlotte-called-Lottie
- Leave open the possibility of using the name Joseph (or even Josephine) in the future
A SISTER FOR CHARLOTTE “LOTTIE” EDEN
ADELAIDE “ADDIE”
Addie is popular, as a short form of Addison, Adeline, and Adalyn. But Adelaide is relatively uncommon and it’s a bit of a heavy hitter – regal, saintly, distinctive.
BEATRICE “BEA”
Smart and tailored, just like Charlotte.
GEORGIA “GEORGIE”
Another feminine form of a classic masculine name. Georgia is high-energy and Georgie is darling.
KATHERINE “KIT”
Strong and enduring Katherine is a timeless name. Kate is the obvious short form, but just like you’ve chosen Lottie instead of Charlie, I wonder if you’d prefer Kit over Kate?
LOUISE “LOU”
Lots of Lou names would work, but I like the way Charlotte and Louise are both subtly French and quietly restrained.
MARGARET “MAISIE”
I’m not sure about Margaret with your surname, but I’m so into Maisie that I’m going to stick with it.
ROSALIE “ROSIE”
Another name with lots of variations, Rose can be as spare or elaborate as you like.
TERESA “TESS”
Teresa is the kind of name that everybody knows, but relatively few of us are choosing. And Tess is a sweet, vintage nickname name that I love with Lottie.
Overall, I love Katherine called Kit best of all, and I wonder if another modern middle would help: Katherine “Kit” Avery, maybe? Beatrice “Bea” is great, too. Maybe Beatrice “Bea” Violet?
Another option could be to choose Josephine or Jo as a middle name. Something like Teresa “Tess” Josephine might be lovely, too.
And lastly, without knowing how you’ll answer the all-important question? I do think I’d probably lean toward using the name Josephine for this baby. Josephine “Josie” Merritt, maybe?
Readers, over to you! What would you suggest – is saving a name for a son wise, or should they name this baby Josephine? If not Josephine, what would you name a sister for Charlotte “Lottie” Eden?
Seconding Antonia, Theodora, and Magnolia:
Gwendolyn
Isadora
Marigold ‘Goldie’
Roxana
Sabrina
Leona
Fenella
Odessa
I support the idea of using Josephine or the even rarer Josepha for this child. You could even use Joseph as a middle name if it’s the name itself you want to honor. I like Finnie or Phinnie as a nn for Josephine to go with Lottie.
For Abby’s suggestion of Beatrice, I would change it to Beatrix maybe and use the nn Trixie.
Other suggestions: Sarah called Sally or Sadie; Mercedes called Sadie, Esther called Star; Susannah called Zuzu; Suzette called Suzy; Corrina called Cora; Eliza called Lizzy; Elsbeth called Betty; Meredith called Edie; Jennifer called Fern; Carolyn called Lynnie.
Use it as a middle name. Give her a first name you just like. Charlotte might wonder why she didn’t get a family name.
Charlotte “Lottie Eden and . . .
Cecilia “Cece”
Eleanor “Ellie”, “Nell”, “Nora”, etc
Eliza “Ellie” or “Lizzy”
Evelyn “Eve” or “Evie”
Florence “Flora”
Isabelle “Izzy”
Matilda “Tilly”
Theodora “Thea” or “Teddy”
I agree that you should only use Josephine if you love the name, not just the connections. But adding significance to your daughter’s name should be important! I knew a family that had two daughters: Charlotte Evelyn and Elizabeth Cate: CE and EC. What about Charlotte Eden and Eleanor Cecilia, Charlotte Eden and Evelyn Cate, or Charlotte Eden and Eliza Claire. Or another CE, like Cecilia: Charlotte Eden and Cecilia Eleanor, Charlotte Eden and Cecilia Evelyn. Good luck and sorry for any repeats!
It seems like your husband doesn’t like Josephine as much as he likes Joseph, so it doesn’t make sense to him using that name.
It seems like you should start fresh, even though Josephine sounds like a perfectly good match to Charlote.
I suggest Amelia Ruby nn Millie. Lottie and Millie!
I really appreciate Arden’s perspective on this. I agree that boys aren’t the only ones to carry generations and history forward, so if you want to honour the two Josephs, Josephine is a wonderful opportunity. My eldest has a feminized version of male name that honours three men and one woman in her family tree – and both sides of our family think it’s pretty neat. Charlotte & Josephine are beautiful together. Would you consider Posey as a nickname? I think that strikes the same note as Lottie.
I do get that it seems you’ve set a precedent with a name you love for a daughter. Honour names didn’t factor in the first time, so maybe you’re hesitant to give little sister the more signifigant name. I know families who are all or nothing – all the kids get honour names or none. Maybe you should stick with none? Maybe you decide your pattern is just names you love with unexpected nicknames. Frances ‘Franny’ is lovely. And I love all the suggestions on Abby’s list. I agree Katherine ‘Kit’ is the name to beat, maybe Katherine Remy (I like how Eden has three of the letters from your name… a kind of honour… so continuing that because mom should be honoured too!)
I don’t want to be “that” person, but I’d strongly consider trying to find a name with significance beyond liking for your daughter, even if Josephine doesn’t feel right for any number of reasons. Saving family/honor names for sons can inadvertently send the wrong message to daughters about their value within the family. My parents gave my brother two honor names and chose names they “just liked” for me, and I remember feeling left out and having the sense that they thought that men’s names and histories were more important. It doesn’t have to be a straight-up family name to feel significant—my cousin named her daughter Ruby because she and her husband adore The Wizard of Oz, and my best friend named hers London, where her parents met.
Great advice from Abby and commenters as always. I agree that once you decide what factors about Joseph are most special to you then you will have an easier time choosing whether to use it now or save it.
If family significance is top priority then I would say use it now, whether as a first name or in the middle, since you aren’t sure if there will be a third baby and even if there is, there’s no guarantee that baby will be a boy.
If Joseph just happens to be a name you really like but maybe Josephine doesn’t feel the same for a girl then there’s no harm in exploring other naming options.
I think Charlotte “Lottie” and Josephine “Josie” are great but here are some other ideas:
Penelope – Penny, Ellie, Lola, Nell
Felicity- Lissy, Flick, Izzy
Eleanor- Ellie, Nora/h
Annabel- Annie, Bell
Grace- Gracie
Sarah – Sadie
Lucille – Lucy
Frances or Francesca- Frankie
Elizabeth -Eliza, Bette (bet)
Amelia/Emilia- Mia, Millie, Lia, Emmy
My favorite suggestion so far though is Katherine “Kit” and I agree a more modern middle name to match Eden would be fun as well
I think you & your husband need to decide if you really are saving “Joseph” for a son as an honor name for the male members of your family and even if you had six daughters, it still would be a name that you would want to reserve for a son. I think Josephine is a beautiful name, but if you want to feel freer and just decide that you would only use Joseph for a boy – whether there will be a boy or not – you can choose this daughter’s name the same way you chose Charlotte “Lottie” Eden-just by choosing names you both like.
Here are some more ideas that I think work well with Charlotte “Lottie”-
The name you like Frances “Francie”
Greta
Elizabeth “Betty”
Rosalind “Rosie”
Sasha
Eleanor “Ellie”
Magnolia “Noli”
Camilla “Cami”
Antonia “Toni” or “Nia”
Millicent “Millie”
Genevieve “Evie”
Cecilia “Cece” or “Cici”
Serena
Imogen “Immi”
Best wishes!!